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IDProjectCategoryView StatusDate SubmittedLast Update
0000397Dwarf FortressMap Featurespublic2010-04-04 07:052015-01-18 17:28
ReporterBrandon816 
Assigned Tolethosor 
PrioritynormalSeveritymajorReproducibilityhave not tried
StatusconfirmedResolutionopen 
PlatformOSOS Version
Product Version 
Target VersionFixed in Version 
Summary0000397: Creatures fall too fast through magma, die of bleeding instead of melting/suffocating, scout out/reveal areas while dying
DescriptionAlright, since I don't like having to deal with all the new immigrants, and didn't have any triggerable traps yet, I built a basic bridge over the volcano in the map, set all the immigrants I didn't want into squads and had them stand over that bridge, while I removed the bridge with a lever. Wow. I tried it out with just one guy at first to make sure it would work, and, right now, he has fallen 120+ z-levels through the lava, and landed on the bottom of the map.

Firstly, he fell through way too fast. Lava is supposed to be viscous.

Secondly, some of the deeper magma tiles contained "A pile of mud". I'm not exactly sure how that mud wouldn't be lava too, or even how the mud got there.

Thirdly, I would imagine that the magma pipe bottom should act more like a chasm, allowing objects to fall through, instead of just stopping at the bottom. But, I can understand how this might be an issue with keeping the magma itself contained.

Fourthly, and this is the important one, is the utter lack of damage he is taking. Not only is he not on fire, but by the time he hit the bottom, he only suffered minor damage to his upper body, lower body, and neck. Hell, not even the impact with the bottom of the map hurt him (although he was stunned for a few moments). He wound up just bleeding to death, with all minimal wounds. Honestly, I'm surprised he didn't just die from drowning first, considering he was pale for awhile before dying.

Also of interest, he did scout out the volcanic pipe quite well. He found several magma expansions underground, including one that contained a magma pool in an underground cavern. Also, the bottom floors contained walls next to the magma that weren't obsidian (granite, native gold, native silver, microcline, cassiterite, cobaltite, bismuthinite, cryolite, mica, tetrahedrite). Apparently, the code that forms different veins of minerals underground, while not affecting the magma pipe itself, does affect the new magma expansions, which also might be a bug.
Steps To ReproduceDrop any dwarf into a volcano.
Tagsmagma, magma pipe, temperature
Attached Files

- Relationships
has duplicate 0001291closedFootkerchief Magma seas do not burn you but act as water 
has duplicate 0001329closedFootkerchief Magma behaves oddly 
has duplicate 0003102resolvedLogical2u Magma in a volcano does not inflict wounds. 
has duplicate 0000905resolvedFootkerchief Dwarves/Some other creatures in Magma bleed to death 
has duplicate 0005846resolvedKnight Otu Dwarf's falling into magma survive for multiple Z-levels 
related to 0002984resolvedFootkerchief Mass reports of minerals and gems found in cavern 
child of 0000307new No announcements for blistering/charring, and other fire-related problems 

-  Notes
(0000897)
opsneakie (reporter)
2010-04-04 11:21

 Do you have temperature enabled? If you don't, he'll just fall through the lava harmlessly and eventually suffocate/bleed out etc.

If you do have temp on, I'm confused. I've seen everything that touches lava die horribly so far.
(0000900)
DoctorZuber (reporter)
2010-04-04 11:42

 I think someone did say something about splatter not behaving correctly in lava/magma. I haven't tried to confirm.
(0000931)
Brandon816 (reporter)
2010-04-04 14:03

 Yup, temperature is on. Maybe it was because he was already (technically) falling, and therefore kept falling till he hit something solid, but even then he still didn't catch fire (nor did the others which followed shortly after, in the name of bug catching of course). I'm kind of confused by this too, my experiences with 40d are that either the dwarf and the clothes would catch fire almost instantly, roasting the dwarf rather quickly.
(0000941)
DoctorZuber (reporter)
2010-04-04 15:32

 Interesting. If what you're saying is accurate, it seems that water is more dangerous than magma all of a sudden. refer to 0000190.

You might try getting your . . . test subjects, wet before exposing them to magma and see what happens.
(0002704)
DoctorZuber (reporter)
2010-04-10 21:25

 I noticed another quirk in magma. It appears that it doesn't flow. Which is to say, I've never seen magma blinking to indicate flow, it still moves like unpressurized water as expected.

This may be related to why it is not covering/melting objects properly as well as why it is not transferring heat as well.

I've verified to myself that a dwarf can actually stand in 7/7 magma (at least briefly) without being killed.
(0004106)
Corona688 (reporter)
2010-04-18 14:06

 I sent a dwarf all the way to the bottom of a magma pipe by accident (100+ z-levels) and he found the magma sea before he drowned.
(0004217)
Jimmy (reporter)
2010-04-19 04:40

 Note that dwarves, other creatures and objects do not react to temperatures until they land on a solid surface. 40d was similar in this respect, where a goblin dropped into a magma shaft would die only when they reached the bottom or hit a ledge. Objects in flight or falling do not exist according to dwarven physics.
(0006324)
Kefka (reporter)
2010-05-06 18:32

 Actually what happens is that death by heat (like in old DF "The goblin has died in the heat") does not exist anymore. Creatures exposed to magma have their tissues (mainly fat) melt and then die of secondary bleeding. Obviously this is wrong for a number of reasons.
(0012085)
Quietust (reporter)
2010-08-25 10:17
edited on: 2010-08-25 10:38

 In Arena mode, I had a dwarf jump into the deep end of the magma pool, and it took 5 steps at Speed:170 before he bled to death, and at the time, all of his limbs were merely "melted" and bleeding.

Upon changing the material properties of flesh and organs to reduce their HEATDAM_POINT and SPEC_HEAT (mostly to 10120 and 2000, respectively), I was able to actually get a dwarf burned while submerged in magma, though it still took several steps before he bled to death.

After reverting the raws, I did another test in Arena mode using depth 6 magma (to prevent drowning) and a Giant - at 100fps, it took about 7 seconds for it to catch fire, then another 12 seconds or so before it either "burned to death" or "died in the heat", so it's definitely still possible for this to happen. Other sufficiently large creatures behave similarly (since they have a lot more blood), whereas smaller creatures tend to bleed to death before they ever catch fire.

Something is almost certainly broken with heat transfer and/or the material properties of flesh/organs - with a temperature difference of 1933°F, magma should be able to conduct enough heat into a dwarf's body quickly enough to make it burst into flames almost instantly.
(0015446)
RossM (reporter)
2011-02-24 09:14

 Realistically, creatures that fall into magma shouldn't sink at all - they should float.

- Issue History
Date Modified Username Field Change
2010-04-04 07:05 Brandon816 New Issue
2010-04-04 11:21 opsneakie Note Added: 0000897
2010-04-04 11:42 DoctorZuber Note Added: 0000900
2010-04-04 14:03 Brandon816 Note Added: 0000931
2010-04-04 15:32 DoctorZuber Note Added: 0000941
2010-04-04 17:38 Qloos Tag Attached: magma pipe
2010-04-04 17:38 Qloos Tag Attached: temperature
2010-04-10 21:25 DoctorZuber Note Added: 0002704
2010-04-18 10:29 Footkerchief Relationship added has duplicate 0001291
2010-04-18 14:06 Corona688 Note Added: 0004106
2010-04-18 15:22 maximusfive Issue Monitored: maximusfive
2010-04-19 04:04 Kennel Tag Attached: magma
2010-04-19 04:40 Jimmy Note Added: 0004217
2010-04-19 09:33 Footkerchief Relationship added has duplicate 0001329
2010-04-19 09:42 Jinalealia Issue Monitored: Jinalealia
2010-05-06 18:32 Kefka Note Added: 0006324
2010-08-25 04:59 Logical2u Relationship added has duplicate 0003102
2010-08-25 08:52 Footkerchief Relationship added child of 0000307
2010-08-25 10:17 Quietust Note Added: 0012085
2010-08-25 10:37 Quietust Note Edited: 0012085 View Revisions
2010-08-25 10:38 Quietust Note Edited: 0012085 View Revisions
2010-08-27 00:20 Dwarfu Relationship added parent of 0000905
2010-08-31 12:45 Moonshine Fox Issue Monitored: Moonshine Fox
2011-02-24 08:59 Footkerchief Relationship deleted parent of 0000905
2011-02-24 09:00 Footkerchief Summary Lava Issues => Dwarf falls too fast through magma, dies of bleeding instead of burns/melting/suffocation, scouts out the underground on his way
2011-02-24 09:00 Footkerchief Summary Dwarf falls too fast through magma, dies of bleeding instead of burns/melting/suffocation, scouts out the underground on his way => Dwarf falls too fast through magma, dies of bleeding instead of melting/suffocation, scouts out the underground while dying
2011-02-24 09:01 Footkerchief Relationship added has duplicate 0000905
2011-02-24 09:14 RossM Note Added: 0015446
2012-04-28 11:13 Knight Otu Relationship added has duplicate 0005846
2014-01-21 20:14 Footkerchief Relationship added related to 0002984
2014-08-03 17:30 lethosor Summary Dwarf falls too fast through magma, dies of bleeding instead of melting/suffocation, scouts out the underground while dying => Creatures falling through magma die of bleeding instead of melting/suffocation, scout out/reveal the underground while dying
2014-08-03 17:31 lethosor Assigned To => lethosor
2014-08-03 17:31 lethosor Status new => acknowledged
2014-08-03 19:38 lethosor Summary Creatures falling through magma die of bleeding instead of melting/suffocation, scout out/reveal the underground while dying => Creatures fall too fast through magma, die of bleeding instead of melting/suffocating, scout out/reveal areas while dying
2015-01-18 17:28 lethosor Status acknowledged => confirmed

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