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|ID||Project||Category||View Status||Date Submitted||Last Update|
|0000397||Dwarf Fortress||Map Features||public||2010-04-04 07:05||2015-01-18 17:28|
|Priority||normal||Severity||major||Reproducibility||have not tried|
|Target Version||Fixed in Version|
|Summary||0000397: Creatures fall too fast through magma, die of bleeding instead of melting/suffocating, scout out/reveal areas while dying|
|Description||Alright, since I don't like having to deal with all the new immigrants, and didn't have any triggerable traps yet, I built a basic bridge over the volcano in the map, set all the immigrants I didn't want into squads and had them stand over that bridge, while I removed the bridge with a lever. Wow. I tried it out with just one guy at first to make sure it would work, and, right now, he has fallen 120+ z-levels through the lava, and landed on the bottom of the map.|
Firstly, he fell through way too fast. Lava is supposed to be viscous.
Secondly, some of the deeper magma tiles contained "A pile of mud". I'm not exactly sure how that mud wouldn't be lava too, or even how the mud got there.
Thirdly, I would imagine that the magma pipe bottom should act more like a chasm, allowing objects to fall through, instead of just stopping at the bottom. But, I can understand how this might be an issue with keeping the magma itself contained.
Fourthly, and this is the important one, is the utter lack of damage he is taking. Not only is he not on fire, but by the time he hit the bottom, he only suffered minor damage to his upper body, lower body, and neck. Hell, not even the impact with the bottom of the map hurt him (although he was stunned for a few moments). He wound up just bleeding to death, with all minimal wounds. Honestly, I'm surprised he didn't just die from drowning first, considering he was pale for awhile before dying.
Also of interest, he did scout out the volcanic pipe quite well. He found several magma expansions underground, including one that contained a magma pool in an underground cavern. Also, the bottom floors contained walls next to the magma that weren't obsidian (granite, native gold, native silver, microcline, cassiterite, cobaltite, bismuthinite, cryolite, mica, tetrahedrite). Apparently, the code that forms different veins of minerals underground, while not affecting the magma pipe itself, does affect the new magma expansions, which also might be a bug.
|Steps To Reproduce||Drop any dwarf into a volcano.|
|Tags||magma, magma pipe, temperature|
Do you have temperature enabled? If you don't, he'll just fall through the lava harmlessly and eventually suffocate/bleed out etc.
If you do have temp on, I'm confused. I've seen everything that touches lava die horribly so far.
|I think someone did say something about splatter not behaving correctly in lava/magma. I haven't tried to confirm.|
|Yup, temperature is on. Maybe it was because he was already (technically) falling, and therefore kept falling till he hit something solid, but even then he still didn't catch fire (nor did the others which followed shortly after, in the name of bug catching of course). I'm kind of confused by this too, my experiences with 40d are that either the dwarf and the clothes would catch fire almost instantly, roasting the dwarf rather quickly.|
Interesting. If what you're saying is accurate, it seems that water is more dangerous than magma all of a sudden. refer to 0000190.
You might try getting your . . . test subjects, wet before exposing them to magma and see what happens.
I noticed another quirk in magma. It appears that it doesn't flow. Which is to say, I've never seen magma blinking to indicate flow, it still moves like unpressurized water as expected.
This may be related to why it is not covering/melting objects properly as well as why it is not transferring heat as well.
I've verified to myself that a dwarf can actually stand in 7/7 magma (at least briefly) without being killed.
|I sent a dwarf all the way to the bottom of a magma pipe by accident (100+ z-levels) and he found the magma sea before he drowned.|
|Note that dwarves, other creatures and objects do not react to temperatures until they land on a solid surface. 40d was similar in this respect, where a goblin dropped into a magma shaft would die only when they reached the bottom or hit a ledge. Objects in flight or falling do not exist according to dwarven physics.|
|Actually what happens is that death by heat (like in old DF "The goblin has died in the heat") does not exist anymore. Creatures exposed to magma have their tissues (mainly fat) melt and then die of secondary bleeding. Obviously this is wrong for a number of reasons.|
edited on: 2010-08-25 10:38
In Arena mode, I had a dwarf jump into the deep end of the magma pool, and it took 5 steps at Speed:170 before he bled to death, and at the time, all of his limbs were merely "melted" and bleeding.
Upon changing the material properties of flesh and organs to reduce their HEATDAM_POINT and SPEC_HEAT (mostly to 10120 and 2000, respectively), I was able to actually get a dwarf burned while submerged in magma, though it still took several steps before he bled to death.
After reverting the raws, I did another test in Arena mode using depth 6 magma (to prevent drowning) and a Giant - at 100fps, it took about 7 seconds for it to catch fire, then another 12 seconds or so before it either "burned to death" or "died in the heat", so it's definitely still possible for this to happen. Other sufficiently large creatures behave similarly (since they have a lot more blood), whereas smaller creatures tend to bleed to death before they ever catch fire.
Something is almost certainly broken with heat transfer and/or the material properties of flesh/organs - with a temperature difference of 1933°F, magma should be able to conduct enough heat into a dwarf's body quickly enough to make it burst into flames almost instantly.
|Realistically, creatures that fall into magma shouldn't sink at all - they should float.|
|2010-04-04 07:05||Brandon816||New Issue|
|2010-04-04 11:21||opsneakie||Note Added: 0000897|
|2010-04-04 11:42||DoctorZuber||Note Added: 0000900|
|2010-04-04 14:03||Brandon816||Note Added: 0000931|
|2010-04-04 15:32||DoctorZuber||Note Added: 0000941|
|2010-04-04 17:38||Qloos||Tag Attached: magma pipe|
|2010-04-04 17:38||Qloos||Tag Attached: temperature|
|2010-04-10 21:25||DoctorZuber||Note Added: 0002704|
|2010-04-18 10:29||Footkerchief||Relationship added||has duplicate 0001291|
|2010-04-18 14:06||Corona688||Note Added: 0004106|
|2010-04-18 15:22||maximusfive||Issue Monitored: maximusfive|
|2010-04-19 04:04||Kennel||Tag Attached: magma|
|2010-04-19 04:40||Jimmy||Note Added: 0004217|
|2010-04-19 09:33||Footkerchief||Relationship added||has duplicate 0001329|
|2010-04-19 09:42||Jinalealia||Issue Monitored: Jinalealia|
|2010-05-06 18:32||Kefka||Note Added: 0006324|
|2010-08-25 04:59||Logical2u||Relationship added||has duplicate 0003102|
|2010-08-25 08:52||Footkerchief||Relationship added||child of 0000307|
|2010-08-25 10:17||Quietust||Note Added: 0012085|
|2010-08-25 10:37||Quietust||Note Edited: 0012085||View Revisions|
|2010-08-25 10:38||Quietust||Note Edited: 0012085||View Revisions|
|2010-08-27 00:20||Dwarfu||Relationship added||parent of 0000905|
|2010-08-31 12:45||Moonshine Fox||Issue Monitored: Moonshine Fox|
|2011-02-24 08:59||Footkerchief||Relationship deleted||parent of 0000905|
|2011-02-24 09:00||Footkerchief||Summary||Lava Issues => Dwarf falls too fast through magma, dies of bleeding instead of burns/melting/suffocation, scouts out the underground on his way|
|2011-02-24 09:00||Footkerchief||Summary||Dwarf falls too fast through magma, dies of bleeding instead of burns/melting/suffocation, scouts out the underground on his way => Dwarf falls too fast through magma, dies of bleeding instead of melting/suffocation, scouts out the underground while dying|
|2011-02-24 09:01||Footkerchief||Relationship added||has duplicate 0000905|
|2011-02-24 09:14||RossM||Note Added: 0015446|
|2012-04-28 11:13||Knight Otu||Relationship added||has duplicate 0005846|
|2014-01-21 20:14||Footkerchief||Relationship added||related to 0002984|
|2014-08-03 17:30||lethosor||Summary||Dwarf falls too fast through magma, dies of bleeding instead of melting/suffocation, scouts out the underground while dying => Creatures falling through magma die of bleeding instead of melting/suffocation, scout out/reveal the underground while dying|
|2014-08-03 17:31||lethosor||Assigned To||=> lethosor|
|2014-08-03 17:31||lethosor||Status||new => acknowledged|
|2014-08-03 19:38||lethosor||Summary||Creatures falling through magma die of bleeding instead of melting/suffocation, scout out/reveal the underground while dying => Creatures fall too fast through magma, die of bleeding instead of melting/suffocating, scout out/reveal areas while dying|
|2015-01-18 17:28||lethosor||Status||acknowledged => confirmed|
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