0005189: Vampires are actually ALCOHOL_DEPENDENT instead of just pretending to be

(0019880)
Logical2u (manager)
2012-02-16 17:36

This might be working as intended - since vampires don't need to drink, but they want to hide that fact, their personality screen (which would allow you, the player, to out them as a vampire) should hide that fact, as you say.

(0020742)
Gukag (reporter)
2012-02-26 10:35

It not only shows them as needing to drink, they will also feel all the degenerative effects a regular dwarf would from not having access to alcohol. This makes dwarf vampires clumsy, weak, and slow workers who perform any task at a snail's pace whatever their attributes or skills.

(0020747)
Footkerchief (manager)
2012-02-26 10:45

Gukag: that's useful information. Could you post a save demonstrating that problem to http://dffd.wimbli.com/ [^] and post the link here?

(0020756)
Cowsquid (reporter)
2012-02-26 11:57

http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=101251.msg3036984#msg3036984 [^]

Suggested cause/fix.

(0021568)
Soadreqm (reporter)
2012-03-18 17:49

I haven't done any extensive testing, but I've noticed that the vampires I've exiled to the caverns, who normally walk slow as molasses thanks to the alcohol withdrawal, still run pretty fast in combat. Fast enough to outrun elk birds, at any rate. This, I think, is intentional, and it's quite possible that the vampire's natural speed would overcome the soberness penalty, but I think it's worth noting. It could be that vampires are simply faking their dependency, and have to keep it up forever since they never fake drinking.

(0024061)
ZzarkLinux (reporter)
2013-07-13 14:52

I have a v34.11 example of the bug here:
http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=7827 [^]

McVamp is in a cycle of:
1) Has thought: Needs alcohol ... and is working slowly due to scarcity
2) Drinks a dwarf
3) Thought Changed: Needs alcohol only
but the vampire is always walking really slow.

Only mods were to the dwarf language (Urist -> Lisa) and added a creature standard tag as here:
http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=126823.0 [^]

(0024062)
skyte100 (reporter)
2013-07-13 15:48

You know it probably is half working as intended. They want alcohol since they want to blend in with the other dwarves but they don't actually drink it so they draw attention to themselves by working so slowly even when alcohol is abundant.

Anyone else think that it should be changed so they periodically drink just to maintain the appearance of a normal dwarf?

(0030341)
Kirkegaard (reporter)
2014-09-24 06:35

Would it be possible to get this one accepted? Surely it must be a bug.

(0030342)
Footkerchief (manager)
2014-09-24 10:45

Kirkegaard, we haven't gotten confirmation for 0.40.x.

(0030494)
Kirkegaard (reporter)
2014-10-02 07:17

On likely example from the forum: http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=144347.msg5704898#msg5704898 [^]

(0030495)
Kirkegaard (reporter)
2014-10-02 07:18

(0031146)
TBeholder (reporter)
2014-11-23 19:38

They should not complain when it attracts attention, yes. But should they want to drink? They are dorfs, after all.
Hmm. How about this? Same as with booze vs. water for normal dwarves.
[ALCOHOL_DEPENDENT] vampire drinks from a creature who consumed alcohol -> it doesn't need any for a while.
[ALCOHOL_DEPENDENT] vampire drinks from a creature who didn't consume alcohol (or stored cattle blood, etc) -> not thirsty anymore, but not happy either.

(0032750)
CLuther88 (reporter)
2015-05-30 13:18

Vampires shouldn't be impossible to track down by the player, but it should be a little harder. Maybe they should drink, and then vomit somewhere in private, preferably outside, so it just looks like cave adaptation.

Issue History
Date Modified	Username	Field	Change
2012-02-16 10:44	Lockyy	New Issue
2012-02-16 17:36	Logical2u	Note Added: 0019880
2012-02-16 17:36	Logical2u	Tag Attached: Intentional/Expected?
2012-02-26 10:35	Gukag	Note Added: 0020742
2012-02-26 10:35	Gukag	Issue Monitored: Gukag
2012-02-26 10:36	Gukag	Issue End Monitor: Gukag
2012-02-26 10:45	Footkerchief	Note Added: 0020747
2012-02-26 11:57	Cowsquid	Note Added: 0020756
2012-02-26 11:58	Cowsquid	Issue Monitored: Cowsquid
2012-02-26 12:15	Footkerchief	Summary	Vampires, despite not needing to drink, show as needing to drink on the personality screen. => Vampires remain ALCOHOL_DEPENDENT instead of just pretending to be
2012-02-26 12:18	Footkerchief	Summary	Vampires remain ALCOHOL_DEPENDENT instead of just pretending to be => Vampires are actually ALCOHOL_DEPENDENT instead of just pretending to be
2012-02-26 12:18	Footkerchief	Tag Detached: Intentional/Expected?
2012-02-27 05:36	Logical2u	Relationship added	has duplicate 0005479
2012-03-18 17:49	Soadreqm	Note Added: 0021568
2013-07-13 14:52	ZzarkLinux	Note Added: 0024061
2013-07-13 15:48	skyte100	Note Added: 0024062
2014-05-31 14:08	Di	Tag Attached: vampire
2014-09-24 04:30	Kirkegaard	Tag Attached: booze
2014-09-24 06:35	Kirkegaard	Note Added: 0030341
2014-09-24 10:45	Footkerchief	Note Added: 0030342
2014-09-24 10:45	Footkerchief	Assigned To	=> Footkerchief
2014-09-24 10:45	Footkerchief	Status	new => needs feedback
2014-10-02 07:17	Kirkegaard	Note Added: 0030494
2014-10-02 07:18	Kirkegaard	Note Added: 0030495
2014-11-23 19:38	TBeholder	Note Added: 0031146
2015-05-30 13:18	CLuther88	Note Added: 0032750

Notes
(0019880) Logical2u (manager) 2012-02-16 17:36	This might be working as intended - since vampires don't need to drink, but they want to hide that fact, their personality screen (which would allow you, the player, to out them as a vampire) should hide that fact, as you say.

(0020742) Gukag (reporter) 2012-02-26 10:35	It not only shows them as needing to drink, they will also feel all the degenerative effects a regular dwarf would from not having access to alcohol. This makes dwarf vampires clumsy, weak, and slow workers who perform any task at a snail's pace whatever their attributes or skills.

(0020747) Footkerchief (manager) 2012-02-26 10:45	Gukag: that's useful information. Could you post a save demonstrating that problem to http://dffd.wimbli.com/ [^] and post the link here?

(0020756) Cowsquid (reporter) 2012-02-26 11:57	http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=101251.msg3036984#msg3036984 [^] Suggested cause/fix.

(0021568) Soadreqm (reporter) 2012-03-18 17:49	I haven't done any extensive testing, but I've noticed that the vampires I've exiled to the caverns, who normally walk slow as molasses thanks to the alcohol withdrawal, still run pretty fast in combat. Fast enough to outrun elk birds, at any rate. This, I think, is intentional, and it's quite possible that the vampire's natural speed would overcome the soberness penalty, but I think it's worth noting. It could be that vampires are simply faking their dependency, and have to keep it up forever since they never fake drinking.

(0024061) ZzarkLinux (reporter) 2013-07-13 14:52	I have a v34.11 example of the bug here: http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=7827 [^] McVamp is in a cycle of: 1) Has thought: Needs alcohol ... and is working slowly due to scarcity 2) Drinks a dwarf 3) Thought Changed: Needs alcohol only but the vampire is always walking really slow. Only mods were to the dwarf language (Urist -> Lisa) and added a creature standard tag as here: http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=126823.0 [^]

(0024062) skyte100 (reporter) 2013-07-13 15:48	You know it probably is half working as intended. They want alcohol since they want to blend in with the other dwarves but they don't actually drink it so they draw attention to themselves by working so slowly even when alcohol is abundant. Anyone else think that it should be changed so they periodically drink just to maintain the appearance of a normal dwarf?

(0030341) Kirkegaard (reporter) 2014-09-24 06:35	Would it be possible to get this one accepted? Surely it must be a bug.

(0030342) Footkerchief (manager) 2014-09-24 10:45	Kirkegaard, we haven't gotten confirmation for 0.40.x.

(0030494) Kirkegaard (reporter) 2014-10-02 07:17	On likely example from the forum: http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=144347.msg5704898#msg5704898 [^]

(0030495) Kirkegaard (reporter) 2014-10-02 07:18	See also: http://www.bay12games.com/dwarves/mantisbt/view.php?id=8389 [^]

(0031146) TBeholder (reporter) 2014-11-23 19:38	They should not complain when it attracts attention, yes. But should they want to drink? They are dorfs, after all. Hmm. How about this? Same as with booze vs. water for normal dwarves. [ALCOHOL_DEPENDENT] vampire drinks from a creature who consumed alcohol -> it doesn't need any for a while. [ALCOHOL_DEPENDENT] vampire drinks from a creature who didn't consume alcohol (or stored cattle blood, etc) -> not thirsty anymore, but not happy either.

(0032750) CLuther88 (reporter) 2015-05-30 13:18	Vampires shouldn't be impossible to track down by the player, but it should be a little harder. Maybe they should drink, and then vomit somewhere in private, preferably outside, so it just looks like cave adaptation.